Logic Platinum Tips

Have just converted to Logic Platinum 5.5.1 after using Reason 2.0 for some time, and although im liking the transition so far, particularly the far better instrument support, theres a couple of fundamental things i often do in reason that i can't work out how to do in logic.

In reason, you can right click on an instrument controller such as volume or filter, and map it to your midi controller knobs so you can control and record the filter movements live from your midi keyboard.

So my question is how do you achieve this in logic? The closest i can get is using object/track based automation, where i can draw in a controller curve against one of logics standard mixer controls such as volume, over a particular sequence. But i cant access the VST's controls this way, and i can't use a midi controller knob to record the curve live...

Much appreciation for any help ppl.. I have more questions but one at a time hey

gday =)

i havent ever used logic before and dont use reason much but...

the knobs and sliders of reason instruments can be assigned CC#'s (or can learn CC#'s) to allow you to adjust the parameter via midi. this is great becuase it allows you to adjust the parameters of each machine via midi (eg external keyboard/knob/slider)

some VST synths have set CC#'s for each parameter (either work out what the CC#'s are by trial and error or consult the user manual of the VST). other VST's such as Native Instruments can learn midi CC#'s (this is wickid as you can assign whatever CC# you want). however, some VST instruments dont respond to any CC#'s for their parameters. it just depends on what VST you are using. alot of VST's only allow you to adjust typical parameters such as volume, cutoff, resonance etc (and dont allow for adjustment of all parameters).

most of the good VST's will allow you to adjust common parameters.

hope that helped.

fuck it off n head for cubase

yeah i figured i would have to assign the controller id's to the VST somehow, but i cant see anywhere to set them, does it have to be done within logics settings or within the VST itself? The VST is a native instruments one, Wired - Elements of trance. some kind of zero-g / NI combined instrument, and it doesnt seem to have any menu's or settings that would allow me to do that.

Nor does any VST ive used for that matter, so i assumed it would have to be assigned through logics menu's somehow.

So do i assume no one uses logic or no one has tried to do this before?

ps: your not helping simple slyman , go back to your mushroom soup

I use Logic Platinum 5.5 and love it.

One way to automate (although its not by using a midi controller) is to go the top of the page in your Arrange window and click on View and your first option is Track Automation. As long as you then have a VST assigned on the channel you're working with, you can then 'draw in the curve' in the automation window. To do this, left click and hold the channel your are working with in the arrange window and pull it down to open it up a bit more and give you more space to work with. Some new parameters will now show including basic ones like volume etc. Each new parameter listed will provide a 'level line' which can click on to create 'markers' and then you can alter the level between the markers.


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This may be too hard to understand what I mean. I learnt it from fiddling around and reading my manual I got with logic so it was a bit easier to do. Let me know it this makes sense or if its just a messy description...

cheers ben, nah im with ya, thats sort of as far as i got, i can draw in track automation for the standard mixer controls like volume & pan etc, but i dont see any of the VST's controls showing up in that list, do you have to add them manually somehow?

So you've never used the midi controller knobs to control a VST ? thats my main goal here, seems its gonna be a tricky one to work out. Have to hand it to reason in that respect, the right click & "map to midi controller" was so damn easy to use.

try and find something about read, latch, etcv etc that appear above the instrument volumes on the mixer screen.. they have something to do with it as well, but i still dont know all about them

QUOTE (Patch @ Oct 12 2004, 02:50 PM)

try and find something about read, latch, etcv etc that appear above the instrument volumes on the mixer screen.

Yes, that's right patchy!

I got this following excerpt out of my online help manual:

Automation Modes
Automation > Track Based Automation > Automation Modes

In every channel strip of the Track Mixer or Audio Mixer, you can select the automation modes individually. At higher vertical zoom levels, the automation mode parameter is also visible in the Track List of the Arrange window. The automation mode can also be set via Key Commands. Given that Track Automation data can be recorded during playback mode, the default setting is Off, as any mix automation may prove disconcerting while arranging. You can choose between the following automation modes in any MIDI or audio (including Audio Instrument, bus and output) object:


Off
Off will disable the current Track Automation data without deleting it. No automation data will be written, nor read and played back. If the current automation mode is Off, any edits to Track Automation data in the Arrange window will automatically switch the automation mode to Read. This ensures that the data, as currently edited, will be played.


Read
Read will automate the current track using the existing automation data.


The data cannot be changed in realtime by touching the fader.


Touch
Touch will automate the current track in the same fashion as Read.


Should the fader be touched, the existing Track Automation data of the current fader type will be replaced by new movements - for as long as the fader is pressed. Touch is the most appropriate, "standard" mode, used for designing the mix. With automation engaged, it provides you with the option of correcting and improving the mix at any time. The time required by a parameter to return to its previously recorded setting, is selected via Options > Track Automation > Automation Settings... > Automation Ramp Time (ms).


Latch
Latch basically works like Touch, but after releasing the fader the current value will replace any existing automation data - for as long as the sequencer is in playback (or record) mode.


Press stop to finish or to define the end of your parameter editing by stopping playback (or recording).


Write
In Write Mode, existing Track Automation data is erased as the Song Position Line passes it.


If you move any of the Mixer's controls, this movement will be recorded - if you don't, existing data passed by the SPL is simply deleted. Use Options > Track Automation > Automation Settings... to determine which kind of data should be erased. The setting 'Write' Mode changes to' allows you to decide to which mode Logic returns after a Write operation has been executed.

Be careful with the Write mode and its settings to ensure that you don't erase your pan, bus, and EQ automation by mistake, if your intention was to only erase some volume fader information!

The Write mode of traditional mix automation will be rarely needed when working with Logic's advanced Track Automation. It's mainly there to complete the selection of automation modes. It's easier to erase the automation data by selecting Options > Track Automation > Delete All Automation Data of Current Track (or ...All Tracks, respectively). In earlier analog mix automation systems, the Write mode was the only way to erase automation data from tape when beginning a new project. Thus Options > Track Automation > Write to End / Write to Right Locator, these are commands which
are self explanatory. One writes Track automation data to the end of the song, and the other to the right locator position.


MIDI
MIDI disconnects the Mixer controls from the Track Automation and switches to Object Based Automation.


The fader will act like a standard external MIDI source and will be recorded and played back as normal MIDI data in MIDI sequences.


Switching Automation Modes For All Channels Simultaneously
Use the right mouse button when switching the mode of a channel strip, and all channel strips which had previously been set to the same automation mode, will switch as well.

Hope that helps

While Logic can do assigning of SYSEX parameters, the implementation is not complete because e-magic has another program designed specifically for this: Soundiver.

It is designed to be integrated into a Logic environment and with it you can assign, control, swap, map and generally mess with SYSEX parameters to your heart's content.
And it doesn't matter if you use Cubase - it's just as handy.

It's the knob twiddler's tool

QUOTE (V-Agent @ Oct 13 2004, 04:47 PM)

While Logic can do assigning of SYSEX parameters, the implementation is not complete because e-magic has another program designed specifically for this: Soundiver. It is designed to be integrated into a Logic environment and with it you can assign, control, swap, map and generally mess with SYSEX parameters to your heart's content. And it doesn't matter if you use Cubase - it's just as handy. It's the knob twiddler's tool

they stopped making it a while back tho didnmt they?

QUOTE (Patch @ Oct 13 2004, 04:50 PM)

QUOTE (V-Agent @ Oct 13 2004, 04:47 PM) While Logic can do assigning of SYSEX parameters, the implementation is not complete because e-magic has another program designed specifically for this: Soundiver. It is designed to be integrated into a Logic environment and with it you can assign, control, swap, map and generally mess with SYSEX parameters to your heart's content. And it doesn't matter if you use Cubase - it's just as handy. It's the knob twiddler's tool they stopped making it a while back tho didnmt they?

thats what I thought too

QUOTE (DJ Ben @ Oct 11 2004, 04:58 PM)

I use Logic Platinum 5.5 and love it.

Yeah, same... It's the bollocks... Took a wee bit to get the hang of, but i had an unfair advantage; I had Sharkey stay with me for a few days to teach me how to use it...

It fuckin rocks though...

Seriously...

QUOTE (Double D @ Oct 13 2004, 10:12 PM)

QUOTE (DJ Ben @ Oct 11 2004, 04:58 PM) I use Logic Platinum 5.5 and love it. Yeah, same... It's the bollocks... Took a wee bit to get the hang of, but i had an unfair advantage; I had Sharkey stay with me for a few days to teach me how to use it... It fuckin rocks though... Seriously...

if only u could make good music on it

QUOTE (Simple Psyman @ Oct 10 2004, 05:11 PM)

fuck it off n head for cubase

that's a large step backwards !

QUOTE (Odyssey @ Oct 13 2004, 11:25 PM)

QUOTE (Simple Psyman @ Oct 10 2004, 05:11 PM) fuck it off n head for cubase that's a large step backwards !

u would have to give us a good Reason

other wise it wouldnt be logic

and we would all have to dance to the Q-Base

QUOTE (HumaN @ Oct 14 2004, 12:28 AM)

QUOTE (Odyssey @ Oct 13 2004, 11:25 PM) QUOTE (Simple Psyman @ Oct 10 2004, 05:11 PM) fuck it off n head for cubase that's a large step backwards ! u would have to give us a good Reason other wise it wouldnt be logic and we would all have to dance to the Q-Base

like fruit loop

QUOTE (Patch @ Oct 13 2004, 04:50 PM)

QUOTE (V-Agent @ Oct 13 2004, 04:47 PM) While Logic can do assigning of SYSEX parameters, the implementation is not complete because e-magic has another program designed specifically for this: Soundiver. It is designed to be integrated into a Logic environment and with it you can assign, control, swap, map and generally mess with SYSEX parameters to your heart's content. And it doesn't matter if you use Cubase - it's just as handy. It's the knob twiddler's tool they stopped making it a while back tho didnmt they?

Possibly, I am not sure as I don't follow the e-magic range closely since Logic went Mac ( ).

I have not heard of a new version for a while, the last version I got about a year and a half ago (v3.8x) for the Mac, and v4.x for the PC and it works brilliantly on both though I do not use a Mac anymore.

It has changed little since it's earlier incarnations, as it has been a very well thought out and implemented program from day 1.
It is the best sysex editor and patch librarian I have found and worth tracking down if you intend to seriously control MIDI sysex data to any extent, especially with controllers and it will provide a solution to the knob control problem very thoroughly.
It's a livesaver if you need to run many different keyboards/sound modules off the same controller through seperate channels, etc., and a huge help with sysex monsters such as Reaktor 4 ensembles.

Is there another program out there which has taken over from soundiver?
Hopefully so, as I'd like to get a newer sysex librarian if there is such a thing, hopefully someone has some leads here.

This post has been edited by V-Agent on Oct 14 2004, 11:48 PM

QUOTE (Patch @ Oct 13 2004, 10:25 PM)

if only u could make good music on it

if only you could keep your records on the foot-path...

QUOTE (Lasermad @ Oct 11 2004, 05:45 PM)

yeah i figured i would have to assign the controller id's to the VST somehow, but i cant see anywhere to set them, does it have to be done within logics settings or within the VST itself? The VST is a native instruments one, Wired - Elements of trance. some kind of zero-g / NI combined instrument, and it doesnt seem to have any menu's or settings that would allow me to do that. Nor does any VST ive used for that matter, so i assumed it would have to be assigned through logics menu's somehow. So do i assume no one uses logic or no one has tried to do this before? ps: your not helping simple slyman , go back to your mushroom soup

its easiest if the vst has "midi learn" for each parameter as most Native Instrument vst's do. however, the elements of trance is a zero g sample library driven by a oem NI kompakt engine. as i havent used it before, im unsure if you can use the "midi learn" function like on normal kompakt. do you have a manual?

i would love a version of elements of trance to see what its like. i have some of the other sample/vst engines that are around but not this one.